TA 152 ,P47M questions????

[ickysdad]

1.Did the TA152 have a problem with it's wing strength in a prolonged dive?I've heard that thier wings were shreaded on occasion.
2.I read once that a P47M was modified to reach 500 MPH!!!! and reached a hieght of 46,500' and was capable of more!!! I understand that both these figures was with full internal fuel and ammo(or at least proper ballast).Are both these figures correct?


If nothing else what are some good websites for info on the P47 & TA152?
Thanks in advance,
Brian

[simon]

First off, welcome onboard.

Anymore details about the Ta152 whose wings "Shreaded" would be useful. Was it damaged in combat? What do you mean by a "prolonged dive?" All aircraft have an absolute maximum speed, above which the plane becomes unmanouvrable, put simply if you put your nose down at full throttle the airflow over the control surfaces becomes so great that they cannot alter the aircraft's heading so it will continue flying downwards at a steadily increasing speed until it either hits the ground or its structure fails due to the excessive stresses placed on it, so depending on what you count as a prolonged dive, and bear in mind damage to the wings may have affected the structure, this does not necessarily indicate an inherent problem.

The Ta152 itself may not have had particular structural issues as such, but by the point in the war that the Ta152 came into service the standard of workmanship in German factories was decreasing significantly and the quality of the finished products was not quite what it should have been, so this may have accounted for operational failures (It certainly did with the He162 Volksjager/Salamander).

As for the P47, a number of these were stripped down slightly, having their guns reduced to 6 or even 4 (although I believe the fuel tankage remained unchanged) to allow them to catch and destroy V-1 Flying Bombs, still 500mph does seem extremely fast for level flight. I'll check through my books at home later to see if I can find any references.

As for good websites, both www.warbirdsresourcegroup.org and www.luftarchiv.de are well worth a look.

[Snick]

Top speed of the V1 was 350 MPH.... Even Spitfires brought them down... Not sure they would mod a P47 just for this...

[curmudgeon]

quote:Originally posted by Snick

Top speed of the V1 was 350 MPH.... Even Spitfires brought them down... Not sure they would mod a P47 just for this...

They did ... P47M

[Snick]

Been wrong before, be wrong again ;)

[Mandrake]

"Even Spitfires brought them down". Not quite sure what you mean by this comment?
The Germans could alternate the speed on the V-1,some flew at 350mph.The top speed was about 400mph.
The P-47M never fired its gun in anger, at any V-1 Buzz-Bombs.The launch sights were over run before the P-47M came in to service.
Btw,the prototype was up and flying, before the V-1 were launch against London.

[simon]

The launch sites may have been over-run, but versions of the He111H series were adapted to carry the V-1. You're right though, the P-47M was never actually needed in it's planned role.

I think the reference to "Even Spitfires could catch them" was possibly influenced by the fact most people don't actually realise the huge difference in performance between the Merlin and Griffin engined Spitfires. The Griffins could quite easily catch a V-1, a Spitfire MkI, probably only in a dive!

[Snick]

What he said... :) Heck sometimes they didn't even waste the bullits. On occassion they would fly the plane up next to the V1 and bring the wing of the plane down and spoil the airflow on the V1. This was enough to put in a dive it couldnt recover from. (This was the exception not the rule though...)

[Mandrake]

I think it`s a myth, that the P-47 was modified to combat the Doodlebug.When the Raf caught on with the He111 tactic, I be inclined to think the mossie would be the suitable aircraft to tackle the He111, That being, it can loiter over the north sea for a longer period.
Yes, When everybody thinks of the Spitfire, they think of the B,O,B.From 39 to 45, the Spitfire was comparable to any other fighter in the sky...And yes the Butcher bird did come as a nasty shock.

[simon]

The FW190 was a shock to the Merlin engined MkVs, the later Griffin engined planes like the MkXIV ran rings around the FW190 A series.

The P47M was modified to enable it to catch V-1s, it was created as a precaution. As I understand it there was a not entirely unreasonable fear that the Germans would use V-1s to attack US air bases destroying planes and killing crews on the ground with no loss to their own. The Americans wanted their own units to be capable of catching the V-1s without having to rely on the RAF for protection. As it was this never happened and the P47M entered service a while after the worst of the V-1 menace had passed.

Actually Flipping V-1s was extremely dangerous. The idea was to fly parallel with and match speeds with the V-1, get a wing under the V-1's wing then roll in the opposite direction. The resulting flip screwed the V-1s Gyroscope and sent it crashing to the ground. The preference was always to use guns, and more than one pilot was killed flipping a V-1. Flipping tended to be reserved for when ammunition ran out or guns and cannon jammed.

Finally the Battle of Britain, often abbreviated to BoB, is typically regarded as June-October 1940.