URSS jet fighters

[Paolo Tagliaferri]

Hi
I wanted to know something more about URSS jet fighters research during WW2...do they got all thier experience from the captured germans jets, or there was an indipendent research about that?

[robert]

This earlier post of mine concerning the Ta 183 and MiG-15 touches on that subject:

http://www.tgplanes.com/Public/snitz/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=200

[GregP]

I am not aware of any USSR jets flown during WWII.

Some time in 1945, the USSR asked to buy some Rolls Royce jet engines from the U.K. and, for some unfathomable reason, the British sold them a batch of engines including a Nene and some earlier engines.

The Russian immediately started to copy the engines and were off and running.

According to my sources, the Yakovlev Yak-15 flew in 1946, the Yak-17 in 1947, The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-9 in 1946, and the MiG-15 around 1950. The MiG-15's airframe was developed around 1948, but it had no engine until the British sold a few Nenes to the USSR.

So, I believe the answer is that there were not any Soviet WWII jets.

However, the Soviets and Russians seem to have a habit of surprising the world with aviation creations. So I, for one, wouldn't be surprised to learn they flew one before WWII ended. If someone asserts that claim, then I hope they are also aware of the engine used.

I believe the first Russian jet engine was the Klimov RD-20, a copy of a Rolls Royce Whittle engine. The MiG-15 had a Klimov VK-1. It was a copy of the Nene.

[tenmmike]

i believe there were no true soviet jet during ww2 but they did have several aircraft that flew with pulse jets in combination with regular piston engines ...but in respect to engine development ..A.M.Lyul'ka should be known as the father of the Soviet Jet engine, as in 1938, wile he was working at the Kharkov Aviation Institute in a team developing the engine and compressor for the Tupolev Pe-8 heavy bomber, he designed a two stage centrifuge turbojet engine (the RDT-1) with an estimated out put of around 500 kg (1,100 lb) of thrust. On the 12/7/1940 the defence committee of the Soviet Government, stressed the necessity of continuing the work on the Lyul'ka engine, with the aim of testing the engine parts by December 1940!
Development of the engine (now named the RTD-1/VDR-2) continued and by 1943 parts of the engine such as the combustion chamber and a two stage axial compressor had been tested successfully. By this stage a full prototype engine had being made "to 70% readiness", work on the RTD-1 stopped in 1943 as Lyul'ka then began work on a larger engine which it was hoped would produce 1,500 kg of thrust, the S-18
RDT-1/VDR-2 The USSR's first turbojet a two stage centrifuge engine, making an estimated 700 kg of thrust, tested in 1943. It was intended to fit the engine in the Gu-VRD fighter, but the project was canceled in mid 1943./////////////////////i cant verify any of this this info except the many attempt at pulse jet employmet (testing) and they did use a few rocket planens with zero sucess other then that they flew during the war and building of a few jets that came out a few months to a year after the war

[robert]

quote:Originally posted by GregP

I am not aware of any USSR jets flown during WWII.

Some time in 1945, the USSR asked to buy some Rolls Royce jet engines from the U.K. and, for some unfathomable reason, the British sold them a batch of engines including a Nene and some earlier engines.

The Russian immediately started to copy the engines and were off and running.

According to my sources, the Yakovlev Yak-15 flew in 1946, the Yak-17 in 1947, The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-9 in 1946, and the MiG-15 around 1950. The MiG-15's airframe was developed around 1948, but it had no engine until the British sold a few Nenes to the USSR.

So, I believe the answer is that there were not any Soviet WWII jets.

However, the Soviets and Russians seem to have a habit of surprising the world with aviation creations. So I, for one, wouldn't be surprised to learn they flew one before WWII ended. If someone asserts that claim, then I hope they are also aware of the engine used.

I believe the first Russian jet engine was the Klimov RD-20, a copy of a Rolls Royce Whittle engine. The MiG-15 had a Klimov VK-1. It was a copy of the Nene.


The first Soviet pure jets to fly were the MiG-9 and Yak-15, both of which flew on April 24, 1946, the MiG about three hours before the Yak. They were each powered by a single RD-10 engine, which was a copy of the German Junkers Jumo 004.

[Corsarius]

By 'Jet' I'll include the designation 'rocket' (which, in principle, is a jet).

In this case, the first armed Russian Jet (the Bereznyak-Isaiev BI-1) flew on the 15th of May, 1942.

This even beats my beloved Me-163.

Mystery pretty much clouds this aircraft. Sources seem to differ even on how many were produced, and if it saw action at all. Most sources agree that it was a rocket fighter in a similar vein to the Komet, armed with two 20mm cannon in the extreme nose. All sources indicate that the programme was deactivated after a fatal crash due to unsolveable aerodynamic problems causing a sudden pitch down. One source I read seems to indicate that this had to do with pitch and compressability as the speed of sound is reached. I see no real reason to disagree with this assessment.

Speed is given as an impressive 990kph, with a burn time of 2 minutes for the D-1A-1100 rocket.

This compares with the maximum speed for the Komet of 960kph and a longer endurance of 6 minutes or so (although I'd be leery of running the rocket for that kind of time).

There seems to have been plans for an advanced model powered by ramjets in the wingtips as well as the rocket. Things get really fuzzy here if these things were ever built, let alone flew.

However, it is safe to say that the BI-1 beat the Me-163 into the skies, and was certainly Russia's first pure jet fighter.

[robert]

quote:Originally posted by Corsarius


However, it is safe to say that the BI-1 beat the Me-163 into the skies, and was certainly Russia's first pure jet fighter.


By "pure jet" in my post above, I specifically disregarded rocket-powered aircraft. But the BI-1 certainly flew before the MiG-9.

Now if you want to go back even further, a Polikarpov I-152 fitted with two ram-jets in addition to the regular piston engine flew in December 1939. An I-153 was also fitted with more powerful ram jets in 1940, once again in addition to its regular piston engine. Jet biplanes - quite the concept!

[i16stealth]

There were some experimental planes, such as Polikarpov's "Malutka" (1944) and the fighter of Suhoi (don't remember the name). Also there were many experiments of installing the rocket boosters on serial soviet fighters (I-15bis, La-7, Yak-9 and so on).